WEBVTT 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:03.839 Is it ever okay to have clever titles for your podcast or 00:00:03.839 --> 00:00:13.599 episodes? Thank you for joining me for The Audacity to Podcast. 00:00:13.599 --> 00:00:14.559 I'm Daniel J. Lewis. 00:00:14.705 --> 00:00:17.905 In podcasting, you've probably heard this advice to come up with 00:00:17.905 --> 00:00:22.304 a title that is so descriptive, so clear that if you were to 00:00:22.304 --> 00:00:25.984 share that title with someone who knew nothing about your show, 00:00:26.144 --> 00:00:29.980 they could accurately guess what your show is about simply from 00:00:29.980 --> 00:00:31.339 the title alone. 00:00:31.500 --> 00:00:35.979 And that is good advice, but it's a guideline, not a law. 00:00:35.979 --> 00:00:39.340 In fact, this goes back to 1 of my favorite quotations from the 00:00:39.340 --> 00:00:42.060 movie Pirates of the Caribbean or Caribbean, whichever way you 00:00:42.060 --> 00:00:42.700 want to pronounce it. 00:00:42.924 --> 00:00:46.445 Your pirates hang the code and hang the rules. 00:00:47.004 --> 00:00:49.085 They're more like guidelines anyway. 00:00:49.244 --> 00:00:52.445 And yes, this is more like a guideline. 00:00:52.524 --> 00:00:56.684 It is not a rule that you absolutely must obey this. 00:00:57.170 --> 00:01:01.170 In fact, if you look at pretty much any list of podcasts out 00:01:01.170 --> 00:01:04.689 there, whether that's a top podcast, some kind of chart somewhere 00:01:04.689 --> 00:01:09.170 in a podcast app, some kind of featured or curated list, even if 00:01:09.329 --> 00:01:10.769 grab your vomit bag, Dave Jackson. 00:01:11.125 --> 00:01:16.004 If you look in new and noteworthy, you will find podcasts of 00:01:16.004 --> 00:01:19.765 varying degrees of success with what we would call clever titles 00:01:19.765 --> 00:01:23.924 or cute titles, unique titles, something that does not directly 00:01:23.924 --> 00:01:26.244 describe what the podcast is about. 00:01:26.750 --> 00:01:29.310 If you'd like to follow along in the notes for this episode, they 00:01:29.310 --> 00:01:31.229 are a simple tap or swipe away. 00:01:31.229 --> 00:01:33.790 Look at the chapters or go to the audacity to 00:01:33.790 --> 00:01:36.829 podcast.com/clevertitles. 00:01:36.909 --> 00:01:41.069 So when is it okay to have clever titles for your podcast or 00:01:41.069 --> 00:01:41.469 episodes? 00:01:41.965 --> 00:01:47.885 Number 1, when clever podcast titles have clarifying subtitles. 00:01:48.125 --> 00:01:51.724 This is actually okay to do inside of Apple Podcast and other 00:01:51.724 --> 00:01:55.245 podcast apps where you have a title that might be something 00:01:55.245 --> 00:01:59.670 clever, unique, something that maybe only hardcore fans of that 00:01:59.670 --> 00:02:03.189 thing that you're talking about would understand that title when 00:02:03.189 --> 00:02:05.909 they see it, and maybe even know what the show is about from 00:02:05.909 --> 00:02:08.950 that, even if it's not the kind of title they're searching for. 00:02:09.349 --> 00:02:14.145 But you still want people to be able to easily find your show by 00:02:14.145 --> 00:02:16.545 searching for the thing that you're talking about. 00:02:16.865 --> 00:02:22.909 And it is okay to include that thing as a clarifying subtitle to 00:02:22.909 --> 00:02:26.590 your title. This is not the opportunity to put in a tagline. 00:02:26.669 --> 00:02:30.269 I would say a tagline is more the kind of promise of what your 00:02:30.269 --> 00:02:31.389 podcast gives. 00:02:31.389 --> 00:02:34.509 Like for The Audacity to Podcast, the tagline is giving you the 00:02:34.509 --> 00:02:37.415 guts and teaching you the tools to start and grow your own 00:02:37.415 --> 00:02:40.215 podcast for passion and profit. That's the tagline. 00:02:40.375 --> 00:02:41.735 That is not the subtitle. 00:02:41.735 --> 00:02:46.455 The subtitle might be something that describes or expands on or 00:02:46.455 --> 00:02:51.040 clarifies the actual title, like a podcast about podcasting. 00:02:51.040 --> 00:02:52.479 That's the subtitle. 00:02:52.479 --> 00:02:56.639 And we can use clarifying subtitles as part of the titles of our 00:02:56.639 --> 00:02:59.920 podcast when we can't have a descriptive title. 00:03:00.000 --> 00:03:04.000 Maybe having the absolute descriptive title would risk infringing 00:03:04.000 --> 00:03:07.534 on someone's trademark, like the Microsoft Podcast. 00:03:08.334 --> 00:03:10.735 Microsoft's not going to be happy about that. 00:03:10.974 --> 00:03:13.935 So don't call your podcast the Microsoft Podcast. 00:03:14.014 --> 00:03:16.254 Maybe not even the Microsoft fan podcast. 00:03:16.254 --> 00:03:20.770 But that doesn't mean you can't use the word Microsoft as a 00:03:20.770 --> 00:03:23.969 clarifying part of your subtitle. 00:03:23.969 --> 00:03:27.490 An example of this from my own experience in podcasting was my TV 00:03:27.490 --> 00:03:30.370 show fan podcast about the TV show Once Upon a Time. 00:03:30.450 --> 00:03:34.435 Our actual name for the podcast was Once. Yeah. 00:03:34.435 --> 00:03:38.675 That 1 word was the name of our podcast, the official name of it. 00:03:38.834 --> 00:03:44.194 But the title in podcast apps appeared as Once hyphen Unofficial 00:03:44.194 --> 00:03:45.715 Once Upon a Time Podcast. 00:03:45.794 --> 00:03:49.360 And that word unofficial was demanded for me to be put in there 00:03:49.360 --> 00:03:52.719 by a very friendly conversation I had with a Disney lawyer. 00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:54.719 And I do say friendly in serious tones. 00:03:54.719 --> 00:03:56.400 I'm not being sarcastic there. 00:03:56.400 --> 00:03:59.840 The lawyer did say, we do not want you to stop podcasting about 00:03:59.840 --> 00:04:00.319 our show. 00:04:00.745 --> 00:04:04.344 We just want to make sure that it's not confused so people don't 00:04:04.344 --> 00:04:07.305 think that your podcast is affiliated with us. 00:04:07.305 --> 00:04:10.025 Because I stuck my foot in my mouth in a way when I had a 00:04:10.025 --> 00:04:12.985 conversation with someone from the Disney team, and that resulted 00:04:12.985 --> 00:04:16.470 in them checking out my artwork and saying, oh, you stole our 00:04:16.470 --> 00:04:19.030 artwork to use for your podcast. And I didn't. 00:04:19.189 --> 00:04:20.389 I designed it myself. 00:04:20.470 --> 00:04:24.470 But I designed it so good and so much like their own artwork that 00:04:24.470 --> 00:04:25.910 they thought I stole it from them. 00:04:25.910 --> 00:04:28.845 So that's when they then said, well, we've got trademark issue 00:04:28.845 --> 00:04:30.605 here then, not a copyright issue. 00:04:30.685 --> 00:04:34.125 You have designed your podcast to look too much like the official 00:04:34.125 --> 00:04:37.404 stuff. So it looks like yours is an official podcast. 00:04:37.485 --> 00:04:41.004 We just need you to make it obvious that it's not official. 00:04:41.350 --> 00:04:46.310 So they were okay with my using Once Upon a Time in subtitles on 00:04:46.310 --> 00:04:47.670 the website, all of this stuff. 00:04:47.670 --> 00:04:50.230 They just want it to be clear that it was unofficial. 00:04:50.310 --> 00:04:53.589 I've run into other trademark issues like that with my own 00:04:53.589 --> 00:04:56.384 podcast or podcasters that I've worked with, where I've seen 00:04:56.384 --> 00:04:59.185 things like that where you risk infringing on someone's 00:04:59.185 --> 00:04:59.665 trademark. 00:04:59.665 --> 00:05:02.305 And infringing on someone's trademark, by the way, doesn't just 00:05:02.305 --> 00:05:06.705 mean using the exact same words in the exact same order. 00:05:06.865 --> 00:05:13.279 It could be when the words are changed just enough to cause some 00:05:13.279 --> 00:05:14.720 potential confusion. 00:05:15.120 --> 00:05:17.839 And so that's why many people will try to come up with those 00:05:17.839 --> 00:05:22.240 unique or clever podcast titles because they want something that 00:05:22.240 --> 00:05:26.800 fits what they're talking about, but they also don't want to risk 00:05:25.944 --> 00:05:27.545 infringing on a trademark. 00:05:27.705 --> 00:05:30.264 That's where the clarifying subtitles come in. 00:05:30.345 --> 00:05:32.185 And this isn't about keyword stuffing. 00:05:32.185 --> 00:05:35.625 That's what taglines often do is they have all of those keywords 00:05:35.625 --> 00:05:37.464 in there in in clever ways. 00:05:37.464 --> 00:05:40.839 So your subtitle is not entrepreneurship, business, passive 00:05:40.839 --> 00:05:43.639 income, money making, blah blah blah blah blah. No. 00:05:43.639 --> 00:05:45.639 Just a clarifying thing. 00:05:45.639 --> 00:05:49.079 Something that just makes your title a little bit more clear when 00:05:49.079 --> 00:05:52.694 your title is not obvious what your show is about, you can add 00:05:52.694 --> 00:05:55.254 that subtitle to clarify what it is about. 00:05:55.254 --> 00:05:58.455 And when I say subtitle, I do mean putting that in the title, 00:05:58.455 --> 00:06:01.895 like what we did with once hyphen unofficial Once Upon a Time 00:06:01.894 --> 00:06:02.615 podcast. 00:06:02.694 --> 00:06:06.800 So that unofficial Once Upon a Time podcast was the subtitle 00:06:06.800 --> 00:06:11.040 included in that title field, and Apple is okay with that. 00:06:11.199 --> 00:06:15.279 Apple is not okay with your keyword stuffing in there, like if we 00:06:15.279 --> 00:06:18.480 started putting in theories and character names and all of that 00:06:18.480 --> 00:06:18.720 stuff. 00:06:18.845 --> 00:06:22.605 And you see some people try to do this until they hit a 00:06:22.605 --> 00:06:25.405 particular chart or ranking or some kind of algorithm, and then 00:06:25.405 --> 00:06:27.805 they get kicked out of Apple. And that's happened to me. 00:06:27.805 --> 00:06:30.764 And I let that happen to me because I wanted to experience and I 00:06:30.764 --> 00:06:32.605 wanted to see when that trigger point was. 00:06:32.790 --> 00:06:35.750 I did a whole episode about that previously in the past, and you 00:06:35.750 --> 00:06:39.509 can hear that full story in episode 334, and I've got the link to 00:06:39.509 --> 00:06:41.990 that in the notes for this episode as well as the chapter right 00:06:41.990 --> 00:06:42.470 now. 00:06:42.470 --> 00:06:45.029 So go back and listen to that to learn more about what happened, 00:06:45.029 --> 00:06:47.350 why it happened, and some advice and lessons from that. 00:06:47.754 --> 00:06:51.754 But when you have a clever podcast title, that's not necessarily 00:06:51.754 --> 00:06:55.194 a bad thing because you can add that clarifying subtitle. 00:06:55.194 --> 00:06:57.675 So that not only clarifies what the podcast is about, but that 00:06:57.675 --> 00:07:00.954 does also make the podcast findable for that 1 term. 00:07:00.954 --> 00:07:03.639 And that's the thing I think you should think about is what is 00:07:03.639 --> 00:07:09.480 that 1 single most important term that people would not think to 00:07:09.480 --> 00:07:12.839 search for your podcast title, but they would search for this 00:07:12.839 --> 00:07:14.040 particular term. 00:07:14.120 --> 00:07:17.400 If you're doing a podcast about a TV show, a movie, a video game, 00:07:17.400 --> 00:07:19.854 a book series, a product, anything like that. 00:07:19.935 --> 00:07:24.334 That proper noun is most likely that term for you, that 1 single 00:07:24.334 --> 00:07:24.975 term. 00:07:25.134 --> 00:07:29.214 And you could probably use that inside a subtitle, not the 00:07:29.214 --> 00:07:32.334 official title of your podcast, but a clarifying subtitle. 00:07:32.479 --> 00:07:33.839 Please talk to a lawyer. 00:07:33.839 --> 00:07:36.639 If you're concerned about this, and you should be concerned, so 00:07:36.639 --> 00:07:38.079 please talk to a lawyer for sure. 00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:40.959 I'm not going to tell you what you can be allowed to do, but I 00:07:40.959 --> 00:07:43.600 will tell you things that you're not allowed to do, and that is 00:07:43.600 --> 00:07:48.240 stuff like using that trademark term as your actual title. 00:07:48.375 --> 00:07:52.055 Like the Once Upon a Time Podcast, the Microsoft Podcast, the 00:07:52.055 --> 00:07:56.055 iPod Podcast. That kind of stuff will get you in legal trouble. 00:07:56.214 --> 00:07:58.375 Do avoid that. 00:07:58.615 --> 00:08:02.134 So that's number 1, when clever podcast titles have clarifying 00:08:02.134 --> 00:08:02.694 subtitles. 00:08:02.850 --> 00:08:07.170 Number 2, when clever episode titles are for entertainment based 00:08:07.170 --> 00:08:07.970 podcasts. 00:08:08.050 --> 00:08:11.889 You might see this sometimes where the title of the podcast is 00:08:11.889 --> 00:08:15.330 very clear what the podcast is about, or maybe they have a 00:08:15.330 --> 00:08:16.370 clarifying subtitle. 00:08:16.514 --> 00:08:20.355 So it does make it obvious what the podcast as a whole is about. 00:08:20.435 --> 00:08:23.235 But then you start looking at the individual episodes, and you 00:08:23.235 --> 00:08:27.875 see these cute or clever titles that sometimes might not even 00:08:27.875 --> 00:08:28.435 make sense. 00:08:28.949 --> 00:08:33.830 And I think that is okay, especially when it's an entertainment 00:08:33.830 --> 00:08:39.990 based podcast because those titles for your audience can often 00:08:39.990 --> 00:08:42.070 make them laugh just by seeing that title. 00:08:42.355 --> 00:08:45.634 Or they see that title and they think, oh, that looks like 00:08:45.634 --> 00:08:48.674 that'll be a really good episode. I wanna listen to that. 00:08:48.674 --> 00:08:51.154 Or that's a funny phrase to use for a title. 00:08:51.154 --> 00:08:52.514 Or what in the world? 00:08:52.514 --> 00:08:55.475 How did that come about as the episode title? 00:08:55.554 --> 00:08:57.715 I want to listen to it because it's a weird title. 00:08:57.840 --> 00:09:02.720 So see, these weird or clever titles can be a way to, in a sense, 00:09:02.960 --> 00:09:08.160 strengthen that commitment from your existing audience to tie 00:09:08.160 --> 00:09:09.519 them deeper into the episode. 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:11.840 And once they listen to the episode, there's that moment. 00:09:11.840 --> 00:09:16.485 And I love this little line from the series on YouTube where this 00:09:16.485 --> 00:09:19.524 guy, Ryan George, does this series where it's the pitch meetings 00:09:19.524 --> 00:09:20.565 for different movies. 00:09:20.644 --> 00:09:23.764 But there's a line that he sometimes says where it's, that's the 00:09:23.764 --> 00:09:24.965 name of the movie. 00:09:25.205 --> 00:09:28.004 And similarly, for your audience, they might be listening to your 00:09:28.004 --> 00:09:31.000 episode and they hear that spot, and then they're like, oh, 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:32.839 that's the name of the episode. 00:09:33.159 --> 00:09:35.959 That can be fun for your audience. Yeah. 00:09:35.959 --> 00:09:38.759 It doesn't appeal to people who aren't your audience. 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:42.279 No one's going to be searching for that clever thing inside a 00:09:42.279 --> 00:09:46.084 podcast app and certainly wouldn't expect to find your episode. 00:09:46.084 --> 00:09:50.245 The more clever your title is, the less likely it will be found 00:09:50.644 --> 00:09:52.964 because people just won't be searching for that. 00:09:52.964 --> 00:09:57.044 But I don't think we should always be so focused on the search 00:09:57.044 --> 00:09:59.125 engine optimization of our titles. 00:09:59.500 --> 00:10:03.180 Sometimes, I think we should just focus on the audience that we 00:10:03.180 --> 00:10:08.860 have and go ahead and let it be a clever episode title when 00:10:09.019 --> 00:10:11.019 you're an entertainment based podcast. 00:10:11.019 --> 00:10:14.540 You're trying to entertain people in some way because then the 00:10:14.540 --> 00:10:18.625 title is part of that package. The title is entertaining. 00:10:18.784 --> 00:10:22.625 Imagine if you had a comedy podcast and the title was simply a 00:10:22.625 --> 00:10:25.985 vanilla description of what was talked about in the episode in 00:10:25.985 --> 00:10:26.625 some way. 00:10:26.704 --> 00:10:29.985 Like, the episode where we talk about childhood stories. 00:10:30.144 --> 00:10:32.929 That's not very fun sounding. 00:10:33.009 --> 00:10:35.169 In fact, that's not all that compelling. 00:10:35.169 --> 00:10:37.889 If it's a comedy podcast, I see that and I think, okay. 00:10:37.889 --> 00:10:39.649 That's what that episode is about. 00:10:39.809 --> 00:10:43.970 It doesn't really spark intrigue and curiosity in me. 00:10:44.144 --> 00:10:47.825 But if it was a clever title, I can't think of 1 at the moment, 00:10:47.825 --> 00:10:51.105 but many of these clever titles come about during the 00:10:51.105 --> 00:10:54.304 conversation in the podcast, that whole, that's the name of the 00:10:54.304 --> 00:10:55.504 episode thing. 00:10:55.665 --> 00:11:00.240 Then when you use that, that can be compelling to your existing 00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:04.559 audience and engaging them and giving them a little chuckle even 00:11:04.559 --> 00:11:06.399 before they press play. 00:11:06.399 --> 00:11:09.440 And that's 1 of those times that I think clever episode titles 00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:14.445 are good. Not so much for informational or educational podcast. 00:11:14.445 --> 00:11:18.605 Like, for The Audacity to Podcast, I try as much as possible to 00:11:18.605 --> 00:11:24.529 have very clear descriptive titles of my episodes Because being 00:11:24.529 --> 00:11:28.290 an informational and educational podcast, I rely a lot on search 00:11:28.290 --> 00:11:32.450 engine optimization, and I try to title my episodes in ways that 00:11:32.450 --> 00:11:35.970 are things that people are actually searching for or questions 00:11:35.970 --> 00:11:40.445 that people have actually asked or would be curious about the 00:11:40.445 --> 00:11:44.285 answers to those questions or curious about the information 00:11:44.285 --> 00:11:47.325 that's presented because they get an idea of what the episode is 00:11:47.325 --> 00:11:51.404 about from the title. I avoid those clever titles in this show. 00:11:51.565 --> 00:11:55.059 In other shows, I've gone with the clever titles, and that can be 00:11:55.059 --> 00:11:58.820 fine for especially entertainment based podcast. 00:11:58.899 --> 00:12:02.259 Number 3, when it's okay to have clever titles for your podcast 00:12:02.259 --> 00:12:07.795 or episodes, when uniqueness is more important than podcast SEO. 00:12:07.795 --> 00:12:10.195 This goes back to the idea of, let's say, you're doing a podcast 00:12:10.195 --> 00:12:11.394 about a TV show. 00:12:11.394 --> 00:12:14.915 We'll use for this example, Stranger Things, since that's a more 00:12:14.915 --> 00:12:15.715 recent show. 00:12:15.795 --> 00:12:18.595 I'm sure there are lots of podcasts out there called Stranger 00:12:18.595 --> 00:12:19.795 Things Podcast. 00:12:20.035 --> 00:12:24.490 And then if and I don't recommend that you tell people to search 00:12:24.490 --> 00:12:27.769 for your podcast inside Apple Podcast, but let's just say you did 00:12:27.769 --> 00:12:31.370 that or someone did because often people will do that. 00:12:31.450 --> 00:12:34.174 They search for Stranger Things Podcast, and then you have to 00:12:34.174 --> 00:12:36.414 start to say, oh, no. It's not that 1. No. 00:12:36.414 --> 00:12:38.735 It's not that 1 either. It's not that 1. It's this 1. 00:12:38.735 --> 00:12:40.414 Or it's the 1 with the blue cover art. 00:12:40.414 --> 00:12:42.654 Well, what happens when another Stranger Things podcast comes 00:12:42.654 --> 00:12:43.934 along with blue cover art? 00:12:43.934 --> 00:12:47.695 Then you have to be more explicit about which 1 it is. 00:12:48.279 --> 00:12:52.919 And that's where, yes, there is the podcast SEO aspect of that, 00:12:52.919 --> 00:12:55.159 including stranger things in the title. 00:12:55.159 --> 00:12:58.200 But you could put that in the subtitle of it and use that in the 00:12:58.200 --> 00:13:00.919 title field, but it's treated like a subtitle. 00:13:00.919 --> 00:13:05.054 So here is where you might want uniqueness instead. 00:13:05.454 --> 00:13:10.894 Like, maybe you call it Hawkins Radio or The Rift or The Upside 00:13:10.894 --> 00:13:13.454 Down Podcast. Something like that. 00:13:13.454 --> 00:13:16.750 See, those are terms that people who watch the show would see 00:13:16.750 --> 00:13:18.269 that and understand. Oh, yeah. 00:13:18.269 --> 00:13:19.870 That's a podcast about stranger things. 00:13:19.870 --> 00:13:21.149 I understand what that's about. 00:13:21.149 --> 00:13:24.750 They're not going to search for that when they're thinking, I 00:13:24.750 --> 00:13:28.669 want a stranger things podcast, and that's why you can put that 00:13:28.669 --> 00:13:31.835 stranger things in your subtitle. 00:13:31.915 --> 00:13:36.634 But the title itself, the official title doesn't have to be 00:13:36.634 --> 00:13:38.555 totally focused on SEO. 00:13:38.715 --> 00:13:42.475 It can be unique, and there are many times when it should be 00:13:42.475 --> 00:13:47.589 unique because there are so many other podcasts out there using 00:13:47.589 --> 00:13:49.110 the same terms. 00:13:49.429 --> 00:13:53.190 If you have a podcast about Stranger Things and you tell people, 00:13:53.269 --> 00:13:56.629 listen to the Upside Downcast, well, that's a lot more 00:13:56.629 --> 00:13:57.509 searchable. 00:13:57.669 --> 00:14:01.365 And it's far more likely that if someone were to search for that 00:14:01.365 --> 00:14:04.245 in their podcast app, which many people will just search their 00:14:04.245 --> 00:14:06.884 podcast app for your podcast when you tell them about it instead 00:14:06.884 --> 00:14:08.004 of visiting the website. 00:14:08.085 --> 00:14:12.389 Although QR codes and NFC, little things where you tap your phone 00:14:12.389 --> 00:14:15.029 to this device and it opens up a page, that can be really good 00:14:15.029 --> 00:14:16.790 too so people then don't have to search. 00:14:16.790 --> 00:14:18.629 They or even type in a URL. 00:14:18.710 --> 00:14:22.470 But that aside, when you have that unique name and they search 00:14:22.470 --> 00:14:27.495 for that instead of just Stranger Things, then they are far more 00:14:27.495 --> 00:14:29.894 likely to arrive on your podcast. 00:14:30.054 --> 00:14:34.455 And when you have that unique name, something that's distinctive, 00:14:35.014 --> 00:14:38.975 you could also trademark that, like I've done for The Audacity to 00:14:38.975 --> 00:14:40.559 Podcast and Podgagement. 00:14:40.559 --> 00:14:44.159 And my latest trademark that I'm happy was finally registered 00:14:44.159 --> 00:14:48.399 fully with the US Patent and Trademark Office is PodChapters. 00:14:48.399 --> 00:14:52.894 Check it out over at podchapters.com for you to add transcripts 00:14:52.894 --> 00:14:55.774 and chapters to your podcast that will engage with your audience 00:14:55.774 --> 00:14:59.774 and even help your audience take action on the things that matter 00:14:59.774 --> 00:15:03.054 most to you, whether that's advertisers, sponsors, affiliate 00:15:03.054 --> 00:15:07.079 opportunities, even just sending feedback to you or seeing 00:15:07.079 --> 00:15:09.799 pictures for your audio podcast. 00:15:09.879 --> 00:15:13.879 There are a lot of ways that chapters enhance the engagement of 00:15:13.879 --> 00:15:16.440 your individual episodes for your audience. 00:15:16.519 --> 00:15:18.279 So go over to podchapters.com. 00:15:18.565 --> 00:15:22.485 And that little ad aside, PodChapters is my latest trademark and 00:15:22.485 --> 00:15:25.764 it is a unique thing. And I love it that way. 00:15:25.845 --> 00:15:27.205 And it is distinctive. 00:15:27.205 --> 00:15:29.445 That's how it could be trademarked like that. 00:15:29.524 --> 00:15:33.220 If it was just simply podcast chapters, well, I don't think that 00:15:33.220 --> 00:15:35.940 could be trademarked because it's too generic. 00:15:36.100 --> 00:15:39.779 And if you have a very generic name for your podcast, yes, that 00:15:39.779 --> 00:15:43.299 might be better for podcast SEO, but then you might not be able 00:15:43.299 --> 00:15:43.940 to trademark it. 00:15:44.195 --> 00:15:48.274 And then also, you're very likely competing with other people who 00:15:48.274 --> 00:15:52.115 use the same kind of generic term, unless you're in a really 00:15:52.115 --> 00:15:54.995 small niche where it's unlikely other people are launching 00:15:54.995 --> 00:15:55.794 podcasts. 00:15:56.034 --> 00:16:01.149 But you sometimes want to focus on the uniqueness more than 00:16:01.149 --> 00:16:02.350 Podcast SEO. 00:16:02.350 --> 00:16:05.549 But the big way to help with your Podcast SEO when you want that 00:16:05.549 --> 00:16:09.789 unique or clever title for the podcast is by simply using a 00:16:09.789 --> 00:16:10.509 subtitle. 00:16:10.589 --> 00:16:15.325 And in such cases, I would recommend still putting that unique 00:16:15.325 --> 00:16:19.245 title first. Okay. A little side tangent rant here. 00:16:19.325 --> 00:16:22.284 Opposite of the way that many people do it at conferences, where 00:16:22.284 --> 00:16:24.845 they give it some kind of unique title for the conference 00:16:24.845 --> 00:16:28.740 session, and then under that is the subtitle, which actually 00:16:28.740 --> 00:16:31.379 describes what the session is about. Why do people do that? 00:16:31.379 --> 00:16:34.820 Why can't we just flip it around so that the session title is 00:16:34.820 --> 00:16:37.700 descriptive, and then you can put the cute stuff in the subtitle? 00:16:37.700 --> 00:16:40.660 But on the podcast side, I think you can put the cute and clever 00:16:40.660 --> 00:16:45.294 stuff first because you're putting the descriptive stuff in there 00:16:45.294 --> 00:16:47.375 more for the SEO aspect of it. 00:16:47.454 --> 00:16:50.735 And I think that can be okay when uniqueness is more important 00:16:50.735 --> 00:16:52.254 than podcast SEO. 00:16:52.254 --> 00:16:57.370 And number 4, when clever titled podcasts have amazing marketing 00:16:57.370 --> 00:16:58.170 behind them. 00:16:58.410 --> 00:17:02.090 There are plenty of highly successful podcasts out there that do 00:17:02.090 --> 00:17:04.170 not have descriptive titles. 00:17:04.170 --> 00:17:07.769 In fact, at the time of recording this, I'm going to read to you 00:17:07.769 --> 00:17:14.095 some of the top podcasts in Apple Podcast as of 03/22/2026. 00:17:14.255 --> 00:17:17.855 Number 1, The Daily. What's that about? I mean, you might guess. 00:17:17.855 --> 00:17:20.335 Maybe Daily News? Okay. Then you might be right. 00:17:20.335 --> 00:17:21.934 Number 2, The Joe Rogan Experience. 00:17:22.279 --> 00:17:25.000 If you don't know who Joe Rogan is or you haven't heard any of 00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:27.480 the news over the last several years, then you'd have no idea 00:17:27.480 --> 00:17:30.119 what that podcast is about. Pod Save America. 00:17:31.639 --> 00:17:37.079 I something about maybe America. Maybe American politics. Maybe. 00:17:37.335 --> 00:17:40.374 Crime junkie. That one's kind of obvious. Dateline NBC. 00:17:40.375 --> 00:17:45.094 The secret world of Ronald Dahl. I have no idea who that is. 00:17:45.174 --> 00:17:47.734 So therefore, I have no idea what that podcast is about. 00:17:47.815 --> 00:17:51.570 Number 7, Love Trapped. I guess that's a dating podcast. 00:17:51.570 --> 00:17:58.769 Number 8, Mick Unplugged. What Mick? Mick Jagger? Mickey Mouse? 00:17:59.490 --> 00:18:02.884 Mickey Rooney? Mick at night? 00:18:02.884 --> 00:18:07.044 I I have no idea what Mick unplugged is or who Mick even is. 00:18:07.044 --> 00:18:12.565 Number 9, trace of suspicion. Number 10, up first. 11, 20 20. 00:18:12.565 --> 00:18:15.765 Is that a vision podcast? Number 12, morbid. 00:18:16.240 --> 00:18:20.479 Number 13, Good Hain with Amy Poehler. 14, 48 hours. 00:18:20.559 --> 00:18:24.799 15, Bridge of Lies. 16, The Tucker Carlson Show. Someone's name. 00:18:24.799 --> 00:18:28.000 If you don't know who that is, you might not have any idea what 00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:28.559 the show is about. 00:18:28.774 --> 00:18:31.255 Even if you do know who that is, you might not know what the show 00:18:31.255 --> 00:18:36.375 is about these days. 17, Mel Robbins Podcast. 18, Real AF. 00:18:36.375 --> 00:18:39.894 19, Stuff You Should Know. And 20, The Sean Ryan Show. 00:18:39.974 --> 00:18:44.799 Now a lot of those podcasts, you would have no idea what they're 00:18:44.799 --> 00:18:49.119 about just from the title alone, especially if you didn't know 00:18:49.119 --> 00:18:52.559 who those people were and what they regularly talk about. 00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:56.595 In fact, like Joe Rogan, with the Joe Rogan experience, his show 00:18:56.595 --> 00:19:00.755 does not have a clearly defined topic. It has an approach. 00:19:00.755 --> 00:19:04.674 It has a style. That is the niche. Joe Rogan is the niche. 00:19:04.835 --> 00:19:08.515 But you could never say it's a podcast about this specific topic 00:19:08.515 --> 00:19:12.549 or for this specific audience because it's not. 00:19:12.549 --> 00:19:14.389 It's not clearly defined like that. 00:19:14.549 --> 00:19:18.950 But a lot of these shows, and the reason that they are so high in 00:19:18.950 --> 00:19:23.349 the charts, at least right now, is because of marketing. 00:19:23.589 --> 00:19:25.509 Think of the podcast Serial. 00:19:25.865 --> 00:19:27.865 If you were to go out there and say, hey. 00:19:27.865 --> 00:19:30.184 I'm thinking of starting a podcast called Serial. 00:19:30.184 --> 00:19:31.944 What do you think that podcast is about? 00:19:32.025 --> 00:19:34.904 I would guess, if you did this years ago before the podcast 00:19:34.904 --> 00:19:37.705 actually came out, I would guess most people would say, I don't 00:19:37.705 --> 00:19:37.865 know. 00:19:37.865 --> 00:19:42.000 Maybe it's like cornflakes, honey nut Cheerios, Apple Jacks, 00:19:42.000 --> 00:19:45.359 Chex, that kind of cereal. No. It wasn't. 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:47.119 It was spelled completely differently. 00:19:47.359 --> 00:19:51.440 But that bad title was made up for by good marketing. 00:19:51.805 --> 00:19:55.164 You could make the case that maybe the show would have had even 00:19:55.164 --> 00:20:00.125 more success than it already did if they had a better title, like 00:20:00.125 --> 00:20:04.125 maybe calling it Serial Crime Investigations or something like 00:20:04.125 --> 00:20:04.525 that. Don't know. 00:20:04.840 --> 00:20:08.039 But, yeah, it's possible it could have had more success. 00:20:08.279 --> 00:20:10.600 We just can't know because we don't have a parallel universe 00:20:10.600 --> 00:20:14.200 where we can do split testing and see which title would actually 00:20:14.200 --> 00:20:15.799 have brought about more success. 00:20:15.880 --> 00:20:18.200 And we can't really know if the title is holding them back, 00:20:18.505 --> 00:20:21.304 again, because we don't have a parallel universe. 00:20:21.304 --> 00:20:23.704 And I talked about this more in episode 373. 00:20:23.704 --> 00:20:26.744 Go back and listen to that if you haven't, where I addressed that 00:20:26.744 --> 00:20:30.744 myth of it's not hurting their podcast and the thinking around 00:20:30.744 --> 00:20:32.424 that and how that's really invalid thinking. 00:20:32.750 --> 00:20:36.990 But that aside, the reason these podcasts are successful are, I 00:20:36.990 --> 00:20:40.509 think, big part because of what they've done outside of the 00:20:40.509 --> 00:20:44.029 podcast itself, the amazing marketing behind it. 00:20:44.190 --> 00:20:47.309 And you can have this with all kinds of products. 00:20:47.309 --> 00:20:51.345 I remember when Apple changed the name of their laptop computers 00:20:51.345 --> 00:20:54.704 from PowerBook to MacBook. 00:20:55.105 --> 00:20:58.384 And that was so hard for many people to say back then, and 00:20:58.384 --> 00:21:00.224 they're like, this is this is ridiculous. 00:21:00.420 --> 00:21:03.380 Apple changed it because they wanted the word Mac inside of it. 00:21:03.380 --> 00:21:07.700 It was the only Mac computer that did not have the word Mac in 00:21:07.700 --> 00:21:07.859 it. 00:21:07.859 --> 00:21:12.100 Like, they had Mac Pro, they had the iMac, the Mac, but then 00:21:12.100 --> 00:21:15.365 there was PowerBook. So they changed it to MacBook. 00:21:15.444 --> 00:21:18.644 And now, it just rolls off our tongue. Or think about iPad. 00:21:18.644 --> 00:21:21.605 When that first came out, people made fun of the names. 00:21:21.605 --> 00:21:24.005 And if you're not sure why they made fun of the names because you 00:21:24.005 --> 00:21:27.684 think it's just a common vernacular these days to say iPad, well, 00:21:27.750 --> 00:21:29.429 think feminine products. 00:21:29.509 --> 00:21:31.829 And that's why people made fun of the name back then. 00:21:31.829 --> 00:21:36.470 But now we just say iPad because there was so much marketing 00:21:36.470 --> 00:21:40.069 behind it so that now people don't think about it so much. 00:21:40.525 --> 00:21:45.085 So when can you have a clever title podcast and not have to worry 00:21:45.085 --> 00:21:48.285 about stuff like the SEO and what people might think the show is 00:21:48.285 --> 00:21:50.045 about from just the title alone? 00:21:50.045 --> 00:21:53.724 Well, you can make up for that with great marketing. 00:21:54.109 --> 00:21:57.470 So these are the 4 cases when I think it's okay to have clever 00:21:57.470 --> 00:21:59.789 titles for your podcast or episodes. 00:21:59.789 --> 00:22:03.710 Number 1, when clever podcast titles have clarifying subtitles. 00:22:03.710 --> 00:22:07.390 Number 2, when clever episode titles are for entertainment based 00:22:07.390 --> 00:22:07.789 podcast. 00:22:08.044 --> 00:22:12.364 Number 3, when uniqueness is more important than podcast SEO. 00:22:12.444 --> 00:22:16.604 And number 4, when clever title podcasts have amazing marketing. 00:22:16.684 --> 00:22:21.410 So if you're in the case where you have a podcast idea or even a 00:22:21.410 --> 00:22:24.450 podcast that's already running and it's using 1 of these clever 00:22:24.450 --> 00:22:28.129 kinds of titles, you might not have to rename it. 00:22:28.450 --> 00:22:30.849 Maybe simply add a subtitle. 00:22:31.009 --> 00:22:34.450 Or if you got lots of money, just throw some marketing at it, and 00:22:34.450 --> 00:22:35.650 that might work for you too. 00:22:36.095 --> 00:22:38.974 If you'd like to share this episode or comment on it, please go 00:22:38.974 --> 00:22:43.775 to the audacitytopodcast.com/clevertitles or use the sharing 00:22:43.775 --> 00:22:47.134 feature inside of your podcast app, and I would be very grateful 00:22:47.134 --> 00:22:47.774 for that. 00:22:47.775 --> 00:22:50.734 I'd also be very grateful if you'd figure out what this podcast 00:22:50.734 --> 00:22:54.150 is worth to you and consider putting a number on that and sending 00:22:54.150 --> 00:22:56.149 that back as some kind of value. 00:22:56.150 --> 00:22:59.829 Whether that's in Satoshis or you want to send actual dollars, 00:22:59.829 --> 00:23:04.144 you can do that through the audacitytopodcast.com/giveback and 00:23:04.144 --> 00:23:07.264 consider giving back whatever value it is to you. 00:23:07.264 --> 00:23:10.544 The audacitytopodcast.com/giveback. 00:23:10.544 --> 00:23:13.904 And now that I've given you some of the guts to maybe keep your 00:23:13.904 --> 00:23:17.509 clever title and taught you some of the tools, it's time for you 00:23:17.509 --> 00:23:21.429 to go start and grow your own podcast for passion and profit. 00:23:21.429 --> 00:23:22.230 I'm Daniel J. 00:23:22.230 --> 00:23:25.269 Lewis from theaudacitytopodcast.com and creator of 00:23:25.269 --> 00:23:27.589 podchapters.com. Thanks for listening.