WEBVTT 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.679 Here's when to not use episode numbers with your podcast. 00:00:10.000 --> 00:00:12.719 Thank you for joining me for The Audacity to Podcast. 00:00:12.719 --> 00:00:13.759 I'm Daniel J. Lewis. 00:00:13.925 --> 00:00:18.085 Following up from my previous episode number 420 about when to 00:00:18.085 --> 00:00:21.524 use episode numbers with your podcast, here are 5 times and 00:00:21.524 --> 00:00:24.244 places to not use episode numbers. 00:00:24.484 --> 00:00:27.429 Before you listen to this episode, please make sure that you've 00:00:27.429 --> 00:00:30.629 already listened to my previous episode number 420 because that 00:00:30.629 --> 00:00:33.350 lays a lot of the foundation that I'll be building on for this 00:00:33.350 --> 00:00:33.829 episode. 00:00:33.829 --> 00:00:36.629 So in the previous episode, I told you when to use episode 00:00:36.629 --> 00:00:39.825 numbers. This 1 is when to not use them. 00:00:39.905 --> 00:00:42.385 And you can follow along in the notes for this episode, a simple 00:00:42.385 --> 00:00:45.344 tap or swipe away, or look at the chapters for this episode. 00:00:45.344 --> 00:00:46.304 And here we go. 00:00:46.304 --> 00:00:50.304 Number 1, don't use episode numbers when they would not matter to 00:00:50.304 --> 00:00:53.409 your audience. This should be the obvious thing. 00:00:53.490 --> 00:00:57.090 When episode numbers do matter to your audience, do use episode 00:00:57.090 --> 00:01:00.609 numbers and use those episode numbers prominently because they 00:01:00.609 --> 00:01:01.729 matter to your audience. 00:01:01.729 --> 00:01:04.614 That's so much of what I covered in my previous episode where I 00:01:04.614 --> 00:01:07.734 talked about using episode numbers for serial podcasts if 00:01:07.734 --> 00:01:10.935 frequently referencing other episodes for file and folder 00:01:10.935 --> 00:01:13.974 organization and when you can't come up with a better episode 00:01:13.974 --> 00:01:14.774 URL. 00:01:14.774 --> 00:01:17.814 Go back and listen to episode 420 for more information about each 00:01:17.814 --> 00:01:18.134 of those. 00:01:18.430 --> 00:01:21.709 But if your episode numbers don't actually matter to your 00:01:21.709 --> 00:01:25.229 audience, so your podcast is not a serial podcast, it's not 00:01:25.229 --> 00:01:28.429 intended to be consumed in a particular order, or you're not 00:01:28.429 --> 00:01:32.525 frequently referencing other episodes, then you probably don't 00:01:32.525 --> 00:01:36.525 need episode numbers because your audience probably doesn't need 00:01:36.525 --> 00:01:39.564 them in those cases. So then don't use them. 00:01:39.564 --> 00:01:43.484 Or if you do use them, if you really, really want to use episode 00:01:43.484 --> 00:01:45.965 numbers in your titles when your audience doesn't actually need 00:01:45.965 --> 00:01:49.939 them, then use those episode numbers at the end of your titles. 00:01:50.099 --> 00:01:54.180 But if your audience does need them, use them front loaded in 00:01:54.180 --> 00:01:54.980 your titles. 00:01:55.060 --> 00:01:58.740 But for most podcasts out there, I think episode numbers really 00:01:58.740 --> 00:02:00.579 don't matter to the audience. 00:02:00.740 --> 00:02:03.754 So if they don't matter, they shouldn't matter to you either. 00:02:03.754 --> 00:02:05.194 Don't use them in your titles. 00:02:05.435 --> 00:02:09.435 Number 2, avoid episode numbers when they conflict with your 00:02:09.435 --> 00:02:13.675 episode titles or else reword your titles. Consider this. 00:02:13.675 --> 00:02:17.860 If you start a lot of your episodes with a number, and whenever 00:02:17.860 --> 00:02:21.460 you're using a number inside your episode titles, I do recommend 00:02:21.460 --> 00:02:25.780 you use the numeral instead of spelling out the number, like, use 00:02:25.780 --> 00:02:30.500 the number 5 instead of f I v e because the number is a lot 00:02:30.500 --> 00:02:31.139 easier to see. 00:02:31.405 --> 00:02:36.284 And numbers in titles can be very good things, like 5 best cream 00:02:36.284 --> 00:02:41.084 sodas, or 10 steps to success, or 3 ways to bake a cake. 00:02:41.084 --> 00:02:43.485 Those can be really good titles. 00:02:43.485 --> 00:02:46.364 It's 1 of the really effective ways to title blog posts, 00:02:46.364 --> 00:02:49.860 articles, podcast episodes, YouTube videos, and much more. 00:02:49.939 --> 00:02:52.099 So that is a good format to follow. 00:02:52.419 --> 00:02:56.419 But if you use episode numbers and you're displaying them 00:02:56.419 --> 00:02:59.780 prominently in your titles because those episode numbers matter 00:02:59.780 --> 00:03:01.539 to your audience, and that's the only time you should be 00:03:01.539 --> 00:03:04.395 displaying them prominently in your episode titles, then you run 00:03:04.395 --> 00:03:05.435 into a conflict. 00:03:05.594 --> 00:03:08.955 Because then you've got 2 numbers right next to each other that 00:03:08.955 --> 00:03:10.795 mean completely different things. 00:03:11.194 --> 00:03:15.514 So take that example of 5 best cream sodas, and maybe it's 00:03:15.514 --> 00:03:21.400 episode 20. So then it looks like it says 20.5 best cream sodas. 00:03:21.800 --> 00:03:23.960 So is this a half episode? 00:03:24.120 --> 00:03:27.959 Are you talking about 20 and a half best cream sodas, or is it 00:03:27.959 --> 00:03:28.680 something else? 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:32.754 A title like that makes your audience have to think and read it 00:03:32.754 --> 00:03:33.395 again. 00:03:33.474 --> 00:03:36.594 And that's not a good thing to make your audience have to reread 00:03:36.594 --> 00:03:40.194 the title multiple times in order to understand what the title is 00:03:40.194 --> 00:03:41.155 actually saying. 00:03:41.394 --> 00:03:45.169 When you're faced with a situation like that, and especially if 00:03:45.169 --> 00:03:48.689 you're doing that kind of title many times, then you might not 00:03:48.689 --> 00:03:53.409 want to use episode numbers after all or consider rewording your 00:03:53.409 --> 00:03:53.970 title. 00:03:54.050 --> 00:03:58.784 So instead of 5 best cream sodas, you could take that word best 00:03:58.784 --> 00:04:01.264 and move that to the beginning of the title. 00:04:01.264 --> 00:04:06.145 So instead of 5 best cream sodas, it's best 5 cream sodas or top 00:04:06.145 --> 00:04:07.585 5 cream sodas. 00:04:07.824 --> 00:04:11.185 That's a way that you can put a word in front of the number 00:04:11.185 --> 00:04:11.985 that's in your title. 00:04:12.250 --> 00:04:16.009 Then when you add the episode number in front of that, it will be 00:04:16.009 --> 00:04:16.970 easier to see. 00:04:17.050 --> 00:04:23.129 So then it would be 20 period space best 5 cream sodas instead of 00:04:23.129 --> 00:04:25.529 20.5 best cream sodas. 00:04:26.004 --> 00:04:30.245 It makes the title a lot more clear, easier to understand, and 00:04:30.245 --> 00:04:32.645 yet it's still a good title. 00:04:32.884 --> 00:04:36.805 But you should avoid putting those numbers next to each other 00:04:36.805 --> 00:04:39.764 when they start to conflict and maybe confuse your audience. 00:04:40.229 --> 00:04:44.230 Even if you do different things like using the word episode, 00:04:44.389 --> 00:04:47.750 which I don't recommend in your episode titles, or if you use a 00:04:47.750 --> 00:04:51.910 pound sign or a hyphen or a colon or any of those punctuations to 00:04:51.910 --> 00:04:55.085 try and separate the episode number from the rest of the title, I 00:04:55.085 --> 00:04:58.365 still think you're going to run into visual confusion and 00:04:58.365 --> 00:05:03.004 conflict when you're combining multiple numbers in the same small 00:05:03.004 --> 00:05:03.725 space. 00:05:04.045 --> 00:05:07.004 So avoid those episode numbers when they might conflict with your 00:05:07.004 --> 00:05:09.645 episode titles or else reword your titles. 00:05:10.120 --> 00:05:15.639 Number 3, don't use the episode's own number within that episode. 00:05:15.879 --> 00:05:18.919 This takes some strategy and some careful planning, but then 00:05:18.919 --> 00:05:23.639 again, also saves you from having to overthink certain things. 00:05:23.720 --> 00:05:28.245 Because when you're inside the episode, speaking the episode, if 00:05:28.245 --> 00:05:32.564 you say that episode's own number, then you've locked that 00:05:32.564 --> 00:05:34.324 episode to that episode number. 00:05:34.324 --> 00:05:37.764 What happens if you're prerecording several episodes in advance 00:05:38.089 --> 00:05:41.129 and then you decide you want to reorder the episodes? 00:05:41.370 --> 00:05:43.770 Well, you've already spoken the episode number within those 00:05:43.770 --> 00:05:47.770 episodes, so now it's going to be strange if those episodes are 00:05:47.770 --> 00:05:52.170 not in that order that you've spoken the number in the episodes 00:05:51.845 --> 00:05:55.365 or the text that's in the metadata and the title of the episode 00:05:55.365 --> 00:06:00.165 starts to conflict with what's in the episode itself, further 00:06:00.165 --> 00:06:01.444 confusing your audience. 00:06:01.444 --> 00:06:05.125 If they see the title says episode 100, but they hear you saying 00:06:05.125 --> 00:06:10.180 welcome to episode 105, then they'll be confused, and it might be 00:06:10.180 --> 00:06:13.620 a little bit embarrassing for you because then your audience 00:06:13.620 --> 00:06:17.460 thinks, ew, they didn't plan this very well, or maybe they made a 00:06:17.460 --> 00:06:20.259 mistake when they recorded this or titled their episode. 00:06:20.259 --> 00:06:23.074 Is this really episode 105, or is this episode 100? 00:06:23.074 --> 00:06:23.875 I don't know anymore. 00:06:23.875 --> 00:06:27.235 See, again, you're making your audience have to think about it 00:06:27.235 --> 00:06:30.514 when they shouldn't have to, or you're outright confusing your 00:06:30.514 --> 00:06:31.154 audience. 00:06:31.475 --> 00:06:36.115 So if you can, don't say the episode's own number within the 00:06:36.115 --> 00:06:36.514 episode. 00:06:36.939 --> 00:06:40.220 This is 1 of the reasons why I recommend using something else 00:06:40.379 --> 00:06:43.819 other than the episode number for the URL of that episode. 00:06:43.819 --> 00:06:47.019 Like, I covered this in my previous episode number 420, where I 00:06:47.019 --> 00:06:50.875 said come up with something else, but if you really can't come up 00:06:50.875 --> 00:06:53.514 with a better URL, go ahead and use the episode number. 00:06:53.514 --> 00:06:56.955 But if you speak that episode number in the episode, even if 00:06:56.955 --> 00:07:00.314 you're saying, like, for this episode, I do know that this will 00:07:00.314 --> 00:07:03.115 be episode 421. But what if I didn't? 00:07:03.470 --> 00:07:05.870 And I said, you can get the notes at the 00:07:05.870 --> 00:07:10.750 audacitytopodcast.com/420one, then I've locked this episode to 00:07:10.750 --> 00:07:13.470 that number even if nowhere else in the episode do I say the 00:07:13.470 --> 00:07:14.030 number. 00:07:14.110 --> 00:07:17.705 And it can get confusing when the URL that you're speaking 00:07:17.944 --> 00:07:22.665 doesn't match the actual episode number that you have used in the 00:07:22.665 --> 00:07:24.264 metadata for the episode. 00:07:24.425 --> 00:07:28.745 So don't use your episode numbers in those cases, and don't use 00:07:28.745 --> 00:07:32.889 it in any way that you are speaking in the episode because that 00:07:32.889 --> 00:07:35.370 locks you to that episode number. 00:07:35.529 --> 00:07:39.529 And this can come up too even if you don't expect to change the 00:07:39.529 --> 00:07:40.730 order of your episodes. 00:07:40.730 --> 00:07:43.209 What if you suddenly decide, oh, there's some late breaking 00:07:43.209 --> 00:07:45.050 information and I need to squeeze that in? 00:07:45.334 --> 00:07:48.134 Then do you start thinking about, like, should it be a half 00:07:48.134 --> 00:07:52.694 number episode, like 20.5 or 1 of those weird things, or should 00:07:52.694 --> 00:07:55.415 you call it a bonus episode or a special episode? 00:07:55.735 --> 00:07:59.814 It starts to get weird because you've locked yourself into 00:08:00.089 --> 00:08:01.610 certain episode numbers. 00:08:01.689 --> 00:08:04.169 But if you didn't speak the episode numbers within those 00:08:04.169 --> 00:08:07.529 episodes, simply rename the files, change the metadata 00:08:07.529 --> 00:08:11.529 information about the episodes, and publish them when they're 00:08:11.529 --> 00:08:14.524 supposed to be published, and your audience won't know that you 00:08:14.524 --> 00:08:17.564 had squeeze in or reorder your episodes or anything like that 00:08:17.564 --> 00:08:22.204 because you never spoke those numbers for that episode within its 00:08:22.204 --> 00:08:23.245 own audio. 00:08:23.324 --> 00:08:26.764 But it's fine to speak the episode numbers for other episodes. 00:08:26.990 --> 00:08:30.670 Like, I've said multiple times, go back and listen to episode 420 00:08:30.670 --> 00:08:33.230 because that episode is already published. 00:08:33.309 --> 00:08:36.269 So its episode number is not going to change. 00:08:36.750 --> 00:08:40.429 Therefore, I can refer to it with absolute knowledge that it will 00:08:40.034 --> 00:08:44.834 always be numbered as 420, and you can go back to it at any point 00:08:44.834 --> 00:08:48.274 in the future and find episode 420, and it will be the same 00:08:48.274 --> 00:08:50.595 episode because it's a past episode. 00:08:50.674 --> 00:08:53.649 But for this current episode, what if I wanted to sneak something 00:08:53.649 --> 00:08:57.169 else in? What if I was prerecording this and change the order? 00:08:57.169 --> 00:09:01.169 That's why you should not use episode numbers within that 00:09:01.169 --> 00:09:02.529 episode's own audio. 00:09:02.769 --> 00:09:07.745 Number 4, don't use the episode numbers in the website, social, 00:09:07.745 --> 00:09:11.345 or SEO titles. The website think of it this way. 00:09:11.345 --> 00:09:15.424 When you're on the website looking at an episode, if you want to 00:09:15.424 --> 00:09:19.360 jump to another episode from there, you simply click the link. 00:09:19.440 --> 00:09:22.879 You don't have to go searching for episode number whatever. 00:09:23.040 --> 00:09:24.720 You just simply click the link. 00:09:24.799 --> 00:09:28.639 And if your audience wants to get the notes from your episode 00:09:28.639 --> 00:09:32.144 that you're currently giving your audience, they shouldn't have 00:09:32.144 --> 00:09:36.865 to go searching for an episode number because whatever URL you've 00:09:36.865 --> 00:09:40.465 spoken in the episode should take them straight to that episode 00:09:40.465 --> 00:09:41.345 on your website. 00:09:41.345 --> 00:09:45.424 And make sure, by the way, if you ever change website platforms 00:09:44.639 --> 00:09:48.879 or domains or anything like that, make sure any URL you've spoken 00:09:48.879 --> 00:09:55.200 that is your own URL, make sure that always works for forever and 00:09:55.200 --> 00:09:55.840 ever. 00:09:56.000 --> 00:10:00.784 As long as your podcast is online, make sure any of your own URLs 00:10:00.784 --> 00:10:03.825 that you've spoken still continue to work. 00:10:03.985 --> 00:10:07.024 That way your audience can jump straight to that web page for 00:10:07.024 --> 00:10:10.465 your episode, and from there, they can click on anything else. 00:10:10.544 --> 00:10:15.069 They should not have to search your website for whatever episode 00:10:15.069 --> 00:10:19.230 they're currently listening to to get the notes for that episode. 00:10:19.389 --> 00:10:21.870 It should be really easy to get those notes. 00:10:21.870 --> 00:10:25.230 And a side note, a special way that you can make this easier also 00:10:25.230 --> 00:10:28.254 that's compatible with many podcast apps is to ensure that 00:10:28.254 --> 00:10:31.455 whatever is creating your podcast RSS feed, that you set the 00:10:31.455 --> 00:10:35.535 permalink for that episode to be that episode's web page. 00:10:35.615 --> 00:10:39.455 That way, in some podcast apps like even Apple Podcast, you can 00:10:39.455 --> 00:10:42.769 click on a link or tap on the link that says episode web page, 00:10:42.769 --> 00:10:45.970 and it takes you to that web page even if you've never spoken the 00:10:45.970 --> 00:10:48.289 URL for that web page within the episode. 00:10:48.370 --> 00:10:50.850 But I do recommend that you speak it because if someone's 00:10:50.850 --> 00:10:53.490 listening a year from now, how are they going to find that 00:10:53.490 --> 00:10:53.809 episode? 00:10:54.105 --> 00:10:57.704 Or if you've given them an episode number, then you are forcing 00:10:57.704 --> 00:10:59.544 them to try to search through your site. 00:10:59.544 --> 00:11:03.544 And if your numbers are not obvious on your website, then it's 00:11:03.544 --> 00:11:04.584 becoming difficult. 00:11:04.584 --> 00:11:07.704 But if you put the numbers on your website, then people who view 00:11:07.704 --> 00:11:11.850 your website see those episode numbers and they don't need to. 00:11:12.009 --> 00:11:14.409 It's that weird kind of circular thing. 00:11:14.409 --> 00:11:15.929 I know it sounds kinda circular. 00:11:16.009 --> 00:11:18.809 It just clutters things on your website when you really don't 00:11:18.809 --> 00:11:20.009 need those episode numbers. 00:11:20.009 --> 00:11:24.044 And especially on social networks, probably no 1 cares on social 00:11:24.044 --> 00:11:27.325 networks when you're publishing your new episode that it's number 00:11:27.404 --> 00:11:32.684 67 or I mean, these days, yeah, 6 7, someone would probably care 00:11:32.684 --> 00:11:33.404 about that. 00:11:33.485 --> 00:11:36.845 But they probably don't really care what the number actually is. 00:11:36.845 --> 00:11:38.040 They just want a title. 00:11:38.040 --> 00:11:41.480 They want some compelling information for why they should listen 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:44.200 to this episode, and the episode number is not compelling 00:11:44.200 --> 00:11:44.920 information. 00:11:45.160 --> 00:11:49.399 And definitely, even if you want to put your episode number in 00:11:49.399 --> 00:11:53.284 the title that displays on the web page when someone is on your 00:11:53.284 --> 00:11:57.924 site, like the post title in WordPress, definitely do not let 00:11:57.924 --> 00:12:01.524 that episode number go out into your SEO title. 00:12:01.684 --> 00:12:05.605 This is sometimes an additional title field that you have control 00:12:05.605 --> 00:12:05.764 over. 00:12:06.159 --> 00:12:09.600 Like in WordPress, you might use the all in 1 SEO plugin, which 00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:13.200 is what I recommend, or you might use the Yoast SEO plugin or 00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:16.320 some other plugin that gives you more control over the search 00:12:16.320 --> 00:12:19.804 engine optimization, that's what SEO stands for, of your website. 00:12:19.804 --> 00:12:22.764 And 1 of the ways it does this is giving you more control over 00:12:22.764 --> 00:12:24.125 the SEO title. 00:12:24.205 --> 00:12:28.845 That is the title that displays when your page shows up in search 00:12:28.845 --> 00:12:29.485 results. 00:12:29.565 --> 00:12:33.079 It's also usually the default title that gets shared out onto 00:12:33.079 --> 00:12:35.720 social networks. So that's why I said the social title. 00:12:35.720 --> 00:12:39.879 Some other tools will let you set specific titles for social 00:12:39.879 --> 00:12:42.839 networks, like social warfare is a plugin that I've used for 00:12:42.839 --> 00:12:46.585 years on my WordPress websites, and it allows me to set what the 00:12:46.585 --> 00:12:47.945 open graph title is. 00:12:47.945 --> 00:12:51.705 And that's the title that would embed in places like x and 00:12:51.705 --> 00:12:55.705 LinkedIn and Facebook and some other social networks when that 00:12:55.705 --> 00:12:58.904 episode URL is shared out, then it would automatically embed this 00:12:58.904 --> 00:13:00.105 little preview of the page. 00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:03.959 And that social title should not have an episode number in it 00:13:03.959 --> 00:13:07.480 because when the episode is shared out onto social networks or it 00:13:07.480 --> 00:13:12.360 shows up in search engine results, the number does not matter at 00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:15.725 all. It's totally wasting space there. 00:13:15.725 --> 00:13:18.924 I know some people will say that episode numbers waste space 00:13:18.924 --> 00:13:20.285 inside podcast apps. 00:13:20.285 --> 00:13:23.644 And I got some good feedback on my previous episode where even 00:13:23.644 --> 00:13:26.205 some people were saying, initially, I was thinking, no. 00:13:26.205 --> 00:13:29.399 Never display the episode number because it's just wasting space. 00:13:29.480 --> 00:13:31.799 But then they heard some of the reasoning behind that and why 00:13:31.799 --> 00:13:33.320 I've changed my own mind. 00:13:33.320 --> 00:13:35.959 And some of my listeners have said, yeah. 00:13:35.959 --> 00:13:39.080 That actually changed my mind too, and that does make sense. 00:13:39.434 --> 00:13:41.995 Still don't like to see it, but that does make sense what you're 00:13:41.995 --> 00:13:44.315 saying, and that does seem like a good use for it. 00:13:44.315 --> 00:13:46.875 Well, you're concerned about wasting characters inside the 00:13:46.875 --> 00:13:50.235 podcast app, but that number is very helpful inside the podcast 00:13:50.235 --> 00:13:54.500 app, but it's not helpful on your website, on social networks, or 00:13:54.500 --> 00:13:55.779 in search engine results. 00:13:55.779 --> 00:13:58.899 And so make sure your episode number does not display in those 00:13:58.899 --> 00:13:59.459 places. 00:13:59.779 --> 00:14:04.579 And then number 5, don't use episode numbers in the iTunes title 00:14:04.579 --> 00:14:08.179 tag. This is a very specific tag inside your RSS feed. 00:14:08.485 --> 00:14:11.445 And you can learn more about how to properly display episode 00:14:11.445 --> 00:14:14.725 numbers with your titles and take advantage of the proper RSS 00:14:14.725 --> 00:14:18.165 tags in my previous episode number 359. 00:14:18.245 --> 00:14:21.044 It's linked in the chapter right now, or you can look at the 00:14:21.044 --> 00:14:24.799 notes for this episode to find the link to episode 3 59 or just 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:27.279 scroll back and find episode 359. 00:14:27.279 --> 00:14:32.320 But if you use the iTunes title tag and you have separate control 00:14:32.320 --> 00:14:36.240 over that from your normal title as it appears in your RSS feed, 00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:39.875 and that's the way it should be that those 2 titles are different 00:14:39.875 --> 00:14:43.394 from each other. Do not put the episode number in there. 00:14:43.394 --> 00:14:46.514 Even if episode numbers are important to your podcast, they 00:14:46.514 --> 00:14:49.715 should never be in the iTunes title tag. 00:14:49.794 --> 00:14:51.955 Apple has been very clear about that. 00:14:52.220 --> 00:14:56.700 The whole point of that tag is to give a clean title that does 00:14:56.700 --> 00:14:58.379 not have the name of your podcast. 00:14:58.379 --> 00:15:00.059 It does not have the episode number. 00:15:00.059 --> 00:15:01.740 It does not have the season number. 00:15:01.740 --> 00:15:04.860 It does not have any other metadata in it. 00:15:04.860 --> 00:15:09.225 It has only the title, and there's a separate iTunes colon 00:15:09.225 --> 00:15:12.904 episode tag, and that's where the episode number should go. 00:15:13.144 --> 00:15:18.424 But your normal title tag that's just title in the RSS feed can 00:15:18.424 --> 00:15:22.019 have an episode number in it, And you should be using a 00:15:22.019 --> 00:15:26.419 publishing tool that lets you populate these 2 differently or 00:15:26.419 --> 00:15:27.860 does it for you automatically. 00:15:27.860 --> 00:15:31.220 And unfortunately, some of the podcast publishing tools from 00:15:31.220 --> 00:15:35.044 providers that I highly respect and normally recommend, sometimes 00:15:35.044 --> 00:15:37.605 they don't do this the smart way. 00:15:37.764 --> 00:15:42.485 They'll either give you multiple title fields to fill out without 00:15:42.485 --> 00:15:46.245 really explaining why you would want 1 or the other, or they are 00:15:46.245 --> 00:15:49.605 copying the exact same title from 1 field to the other. 00:15:50.159 --> 00:15:53.519 Therefore, you're either breaking the rules by putting an episode 00:15:53.519 --> 00:15:57.360 number in the iTunes title field, or you're missing out on 00:15:57.360 --> 00:16:01.200 backwards and cross compatibility by not having an episode number 00:16:01.200 --> 00:16:02.879 in the normal title field. 00:16:02.879 --> 00:16:06.375 And that's if the episode number is important to your audience. 00:16:06.535 --> 00:16:10.054 If it is, it needs to be in that normal title tag, but it should 00:16:10.054 --> 00:16:14.215 not be in the iTunes title tag. That is only for the title. 00:16:14.215 --> 00:16:17.975 The normal title tag can be fine to include an episode number in 00:16:17.975 --> 00:16:20.860 it and even season number and some of the other stuff that 00:16:20.860 --> 00:16:22.620 sometimes people put in their titles. 00:16:22.700 --> 00:16:27.339 But the iTunes colon title tag should be only the title. 00:16:27.419 --> 00:16:28.539 No episodes in it. 00:16:28.539 --> 00:16:32.615 Go back to my episode 359 to learn a lot more detail about how to 00:16:32.615 --> 00:16:35.735 display episode numbers and some different ideas of ways you can 00:16:35.735 --> 00:16:38.855 display some episode numbers in your podcast episodes. 00:16:38.855 --> 00:16:43.654 Just keep in mind that my recommendation for when and when to not 00:16:43.654 --> 00:16:46.879 use episode numbers has changed since that episode. 00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:50.399 And that's what this episode and my previous episode are all 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:50.960 about. 00:16:51.040 --> 00:16:55.680 When to use episode numbers and when to not use episode numbers. 00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:58.800 A little bit of follow-up from my previous episode, I mentioned 00:16:58.800 --> 00:17:02.105 the feedback that I got from some people who were initially in 00:17:02.105 --> 00:17:05.304 disagreement with my recommendations, but then started to come 00:17:05.304 --> 00:17:08.664 around as they started to think about how they use podcast apps 00:17:08.664 --> 00:17:12.984 and that whole idea of keeping the audience inside the podcast 00:17:12.984 --> 00:17:17.065 app and not making them have to leave the app to get the episode 00:17:17.065 --> 00:17:17.625 that they want. 00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:21.119 I think that's the big selling point here of using episode 00:17:21.119 --> 00:17:24.480 numbers is keeping your audience in the podcast app. 00:17:24.480 --> 00:17:27.440 But I discovered some frustrations along the way with this. 00:17:27.440 --> 00:17:31.039 Not only the frustration of how some podcast publishing tools 00:17:31.384 --> 00:17:35.625 don't properly handle the separate titles, so they either force 00:17:35.625 --> 00:17:39.544 you to break Apple's rules or they force you to not have episode 00:17:39.544 --> 00:17:43.865 numbers in all of the podcast apps that don't support the iTunes 00:17:43.865 --> 00:17:46.585 episode tag, which is specifically for episode numbers. 00:17:46.769 --> 00:17:49.890 And by the way, that's most of the podcast apps that don't 00:17:49.890 --> 00:17:51.009 support that field. 00:17:51.089 --> 00:17:56.130 On top of that, Overcast appears, and I don't have complete final 00:17:56.130 --> 00:17:59.089 confirmation of this yet, and this could change in the future. 00:17:59.089 --> 00:18:04.025 But Overcast appears to actually remove the episode numbers from 00:18:04.025 --> 00:18:09.224 the title even though I don't think the Overcast app is using the 00:18:09.224 --> 00:18:13.704 iTunes title tag for its episode titles. 00:18:13.865 --> 00:18:16.904 And it's certainly, at least not right now, using the episode 00:18:16.904 --> 00:18:19.440 number tag to display episode numbers. 00:18:19.519 --> 00:18:23.519 So in Overcast, if you want episode numbers to display, you'll 00:18:23.519 --> 00:18:28.000 have to type them in a different kind of way because Overcast is 00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:29.839 an opinionated app. 00:18:29.839 --> 00:18:33.585 That means that the developer, Marco, has some definite opinions 00:18:33.585 --> 00:18:37.424 of how the app should function and what the experience should be. 00:18:37.585 --> 00:18:41.505 And 1 of his opinions or it seems at least this is his opinion, 00:18:41.585 --> 00:18:45.025 the episode numbers are never relevant, and therefore, they 00:18:45.025 --> 00:18:46.464 should never be shown. 00:18:46.545 --> 00:18:50.119 And it appears then that Overcast is removing those episode 00:18:50.119 --> 00:18:50.679 numbers. 00:18:50.840 --> 00:18:55.400 It could be that it's using the iTunes title field, but then it's 00:18:55.400 --> 00:18:58.519 not using the iTunes episode field to display the episode 00:18:58.519 --> 00:18:58.759 numbers. 00:18:59.015 --> 00:19:02.055 So either way, at least at the time of this recording, the 00:19:02.055 --> 00:19:05.975 overcast version that I have does not display the episode numbers 00:19:05.975 --> 00:19:08.775 at all no matter where you put those episode numbers. 00:19:09.015 --> 00:19:13.589 Before I go, special thanks, huge special thanks to Stevie Taylor 00:19:13.589 --> 00:19:17.589 who sent $30. He's the host of the Gig Life Podcast. 00:19:17.670 --> 00:19:20.630 And he said, hey, Daniel. Thank you for all you do, sir. 00:19:20.630 --> 00:19:24.404 Well, thank you, Stevie, for sending that very kind support to 00:19:24.404 --> 00:19:25.605 The Audacity to Podcast. 00:19:25.605 --> 00:19:29.765 And that's Stevie saying that he values The Audacity to Podcast 00:19:29.765 --> 00:19:33.765 $30. That's fantastic. Thank you so much for that generosity. 00:19:33.765 --> 00:19:37.765 And also, $20 from Randy Black, host of Shooting It Straight 00:19:37.765 --> 00:19:38.244 Podcast. 00:19:38.529 --> 00:19:42.289 And he said, a small amount of support for a friend and 00:19:42.289 --> 00:19:45.170 podcasting legend who gives so much to the space with little 00:19:45.170 --> 00:19:48.369 given back in turn. Keep up the good work, Daniel. 00:19:48.450 --> 00:19:51.250 Thank you so much, Randy. That really means a lot to me. 00:19:51.250 --> 00:19:56.375 And 696 Satoshis streamed from Brian Insmeter, the podcast 00:19:56.375 --> 00:20:00.375 producer at toptieraudio.com where you can hire him to produce 00:20:00.375 --> 00:20:01.654 your podcast for you. 00:20:01.654 --> 00:20:04.535 I've got the links for all 3 of these gentlemen's websites in the 00:20:04.535 --> 00:20:05.815 notes for this episode. 00:20:05.974 --> 00:20:08.934 And if you value The Audacity to Podcast like these other 00:20:08.934 --> 00:20:12.029 gentlemen have, maybe more than that, maybe less than that, it's 00:20:12.029 --> 00:20:15.069 really up to you. What is The Audacity to Podcast worth to you? 00:20:15.069 --> 00:20:17.230 Would you consider giving some of that value back? 00:20:17.230 --> 00:20:22.029 You can do that through the audacitytopodcast.com/giveback. 00:20:22.029 --> 00:20:25.605 And now that I've given you some of the guts to use or not to use 00:20:25.605 --> 00:20:28.244 podcast episode numbers, I'm sure that's probably what 00:20:28.244 --> 00:20:30.884 Shakespeare would have said if he was a podcast consultant, and 00:20:30.884 --> 00:20:32.404 I've taught you some of the tools. 00:20:32.485 --> 00:20:35.445 It's time for you to go start and grow your own podcast for 00:20:35.445 --> 00:20:37.960 passion and profit. I'm Daniel J. 00:20:37.960 --> 00:20:40.519 Lewis from theaudacitytopodcast.com. 00:20:40.519 --> 00:20:43.640 Send me your podcasting questions at podcast feedback dot com 00:20:43.640 --> 00:20:46.039 slash audacity, and thanks for listening.